Let The Debate Begin

Discussion in 'NFL General Discussion' started by markaz, Feb 2, 2015.

  1. markaz

    markaz Resident Cards Fan Staff Member

    So where do you put Bill Belichick and Tom Brady in the conversation of "best ever"?

    It's officially the off-season, but still gotta talk football.
     
  2. CaptainStubing

    CaptainStubing Gave her a Dirty Sanchez

    I think every year that Brady has been healthy they have made the playoffs. They've been to 9 conf champ games during the Brady Era and 6 super bowls, winning 4 of them.

    last night, Brady torched a very good Seahawks defense. I think at this point, we would have to say Brady could be the best ever. In my opinion, it's more about Brady than belichick though. Belichick hasn't done anything without Brady.
     
    DaBears22 likes this.
  3. Diesel44

    Diesel44 Serial Killer

    Brady is for sure a 1st time hall of famer,so is belichick. in my view,because of the cheating controversity,belichik's legacy is gonna always be tainted regardless of what is or is not proven.Brady has gotten a few calls to go his way like the tuck play,but the guy is one hell of a player and deserves all the praise that has been shed on him.
     
  4. markaz

    markaz Resident Cards Fan Staff Member

    I love debates. Just a matter of when the verbal violence begins.

    Until I die I will never put another QB ahead of Joe Montana on the all-time best list. However, at this point I would put Brady in a dead heat. 4 Super Bowl wins, 6 Conference championships and 12 Division titles. Screw the tied with Montana for Super Bowl MVP's....like the HOF it's a stinking vote. Even if Brady wins another, Montana's batting 1.000 in Super Bowls, but it will strengthen his position to be best along with Montana.

    As far as Belichick, I agree 100% about his successes being directly linked to Brady, but at the same time I think Brady's successes were orchestrated by Belichick and his decision making skill. What's surprised me the most is the type of personnel Belichick has brought in over the many years to execute his system. With the possible exception of Vince Wilfork, what HOF-type players has New England ever had through the duration. I discount players like Moss who were only there such a short period of time and succeeded primarily because of Brady and Belichick. Other teams like the Niners and Steelers had the luxury of some of the best talent ever assembled and currently enshrined in the Hall. Like him or not, I'd put Belichick ahead of your Shula's, Lombardi's, Noll's or Walshes.
     
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  5. DaBears22

    DaBears22 Matt Forte = future MVP Staff Member

    I think they'll go down as the top duo in history. Their record is hard to match and they aren't done yet. As for brady being the best, I think montana still holds that place but if brady wins another super bowl and mvp, then it'll have to brady as number one.
     
    markaz likes this.
  6. Walnuts

    Walnuts All-Pro

    Joe's my dude, always will be, but I can't be mad at anyone putting Brady up there with him if they want to. If I wanted to be a little more objective about it I might be on that side of the fence as well, but I don't. Its helps that Brady is a SF kid that grew up loving the Niners and Joe.
     
  7. DawkinsINT

    DawkinsINT Tebow free since 9/5/2015.

    I really wanted Brady to have a horrible game and lose so this wouldn't even be a discussion. His overall body of work though is probably more impressive than Montana's. Especially when you consider he did not have long periods of time with HOF WRs like Joe did. Plus with the free agency aspect of bigger turnover of rosters from year to year, it's impressive as f--k. I was solid Montana, now I consider it a toss-up.
     
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  8. Diesel44

    Diesel44 Serial Killer

    i'd give the edge to TB cause he never had the WR's that JM did like dawk said.
     
  9. Buck Fenson

    Buck Fenson formerly Jake from State Farm

    and I give the nod to Joe for the reason that he didn't lose a Super Bowl. It took Brady two more games to break Joe's touchdown record. And Montana faced defenses like Seattle all the time during his run. The rules against the defense, while tighter than in the 60's and 70's, were more lax. Those were the days of the Chicago defense, the Giants, Eagles, Saints.
     
    86WARD likes this.
  10. 86WARD

    86WARD -

    I hate to add to Tom Brady's case...but...

    View attachment 59338

    These are their records regular season and post season with their Championship Seasons removed...
     
    Steve12 likes this.
  11. SportsChump

    SportsChump Well-Known

  12. TJ

    TJ Dez Caught It

    Brady only has one thing that Montana doesn't have: Super Bowl losses.

    [/thread]
     
    Omen likes this.
  13. markaz

    markaz Resident Cards Fan Staff Member

    [thread] That's why one more SB for Brady solidifies his position as alongside Montana, but not ahead.
     
  14. 86WARD

    86WARD -

    Best "Big Game QB" you'd have to add Bradshaw to the conversation.
     
  15. smeags

    smeags militant geek

    no you dont.
     
  16. markaz

    markaz Resident Cards Fan Staff Member

    Seems like Bradshaw is always omitted from every conversation. The man has four rings...period. Can't put him at the top, but his performances during the biggest game of the NFL year put him ahead of Manning. I don't care if Manning has records that may be untouchable, they're all regular season records and his performances in the post season has to question his "greatness" when he's needed most.
     
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  17. smeags

    smeags militant geek

    HUUUUUUUUGE difference comparing him to the likes of montana, brady, elway. they were the guys the opposing teams game planned for. nobody ever game planned for bradshaw.
     
  18. 86WARD

    86WARD -

    You absolutely have to. I'm not saying best ever, but for the Super Bowl...sure you do. 4 Super Bowls in 6 years. Some of the plays he made on those games against defenses that were mauling his receivers? Yeah...he's worth the mention.
     
    Omen and Buck Fenson like this.
  19. markaz

    markaz Resident Cards Fan Staff Member

    Bradshaw had to be game planned much the same way as Russell Wilson. Not only could he throw but he was threat to run as well and there were designed plays with Bradshaw tucking it with Harris or Blyer as his lead blocker(s). One category that Bradshaw would be the hands down No. 1 would be throwing it 50 yards on a rope with a flick of his wrist.:buttrock:
     
  20. smeags

    smeags militant geek

    no no & lol at comparing his running to wilson's.

    sorry, even bradshaw says he rode the coatails of his receivers. most of those big plays you speak of i remember swan or stallworth making circus catches because the ball was poorly thrown. he's no doubt a clutch qb that is up there with some big games but IMO doesnt deserve to even be in the same book as montana, elway and brady.